Corpse/Regen issues

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Brad
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Corpse/Regen issues

Post by Brad »

I want to dedicate a good block of time to tracking down the corpse/regen issues.

The problems where, you do something to a corpse, and its stops regen.

*FIRST PASS*

Please only list DEFINITE, REPRODUCABLE ways. No "I heards" or "They say"..

Let me get the definites down, then we can move on.

If we fixed this it would fix soooo many spawn issues.

Thanks
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Mihey
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Post by Mihey »

Holding the corpse is one way, but I guess it has been addressed already...?
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Replying to Topic 'Corpse/Regen issues'

Post by Brad »

Yes, holding i understand.. But the player is making a conscious effort to do that, and can tie up a max of two.

Others?
Last edited by Brad on Mon Sep 20, 2004 4:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Replying to Topic 'Corpse/Regen issues'

Post by Virag »

Killed crits can be critcured elsewhere

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Replying to Topic 'Corpse/Regen issues'

Post by Arithawn »

It used to be an old trick for wardens. Kill zoo and cc it in the cage and have a ment babysit the baddies. Eventually one or 2 would poof and slip away kinda like they do when a healer runs a zoo for the HP doc. Eventually they poof and regen where they are supposed to.
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Replying to Topic 'Corpse/Regen issues'

Post by Brad »

These are all good, but im looking for the ones that cause the corpses to get poofed or bugged where the creatures DONT regenerate.

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Post by Arithawn »

That is hard to tell like the other night i was hunting forge with my wife. There was one other person in the area as well but the regen just started slowly dying off. Eventually we were left with 3 critters that regenned and we had to wait for them to rot before a new set would gen. I left for about 45 minutes and came back and regen was back up and working alright it seemed. There wasnt anything genning earlier or corpses scattered around to make me think that we were just beating the regen there just wasnt anything regenning at all for a time.
Last edited by Arithawn on Tue Sep 21, 2004 11:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Frozboz
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Post by Frozboz »

If this has to do with the Forge, this bug has been around since DL opened (and I think you were emailed with the exact details). It has to do with the speed of killing. If you'd like we can run in there later, perhaps when you can watch, and obliterate the area. It only takes about 10 minutes to notice a huge drop in the number of crits.

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Replying to Topic 'Corpse/Regen issues'

Post by Brad »

Hmmmm

Thats an intersting comment, speed of killing. Let me take a look at that

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Post by max|pic »

that also happens in duke lair
if you keep killing them eventually elites will stop regenning unless u leave it for like 2 hours
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Post by Roland »

I've seen that happen in all the scenerios of Drakkar.

One place you can quickly see this in action:

Take a big crit in to kill clickers in Aleria, you will quickly see the regen rate drop off drastically.

Some areas it may appear this is happening, but is it really that when you first goto an area packed with critters, is it cause they wandered to that basic part of the dungeon, and is a basic place they sorta get 'stuck'. When I say 'stuck', I mean, alot of times in areas where things wander around, larger rooms with one door, tend to trap things, they easily find their way in the room, but with only one hex to get out, they more often tend to stay in the big room, prolly has to do with the routine that makes things wander dungeons. So when you goto an area, and see a huge zoo, might be because things sorta wandered and got 'stuck' there, but that isn't their regen spot, room may only have a few 'regen spawn' hexes in it, so after killing the initial zoo, it may appear that the regen has died off.

Note: Aleria regen is weird though, when you first goto an area, it will be packed with monsters, then once you kill off the initial zoo, doesn't seem as many regen in the same area, even if you wait 3-5 minutes, to give time for everything to rot and regen.
Last edited by Roland on Wed Sep 22, 2004 9:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Yeti »

yeah, ive noticed the speed of killing bug in many areas. However, in many other areas it happens the other way around. If you kill fast enough it like juices up the regen, so that when one of the party members has to leave the regen is actually too much to handle.

Most of aleria kills the regen off if you kill too quickly

Upper keep is a good example of an area where the regen actually speeds up if you are killing quick enough

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Post by Frozboz »

That would actually make sense, this happening in Aleria.. I suspect the backend code and some basic starting maps for Nameless were partially copied from Aleria (many reasons why, won't go into them here).

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Replying to Topic 'Corpse/Regen issues'

Post by Brad »

Focus guys please.

Okay.. back to the question.

When you say, "killed off quickly" when an area is "overhunted".. are you talking.. what, one kill every round? or what?

Any idea the rate we are talking about?

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Post by Demonaic »

as in i drop like 60-80 bodies to the ground, and only like 20-40 seem to respawn shortly after, then like 20-30, then like 5-15 at a time, and it kinda levels off at that.

or when i ec'd talinar guards - eliteguards, it'd 1-shot all 6 of them. i'd do that a few times during killing him, then i wouldn't see any for like 20 minutes
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Replying to Topic 'Corpse/Regen issues'

Post by Brad »

Lets focus on the forge area of NL

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Post by Arithawn »

Critters were dropping every 2-3 rounds with another in the area hunting as well using thief tastes. The regen just seemed to half itself and eventually there was nothing to kill but 2-3 critters that regenned. I stayed solo in the area for some time after and that was all that regenned. Left for mormar for a bit like 45 minutes or so and came back and regen was working fine since i was solo again i couldnt kill that fast anyway.
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Post by Frozboz »

Walk in with a party of maxed out primals with maxed out NL killers and primal discs, you'll kill at least 1 per round. In 3-4 minutes, there will be no crits left (except for Titans). Soon thereafter about half of the crits will regenerate. Again, kill off at the rate of at least 1 per round until there are no more left. Few minutes go by, and half of *that* number regens and so on and so forth.. you get the picture. Soon there will only be a handful of crits regenning. Never stuck around much after that, like was said earlier if you come back an hour later the crits do eventually regen.

So as I said, it's something to do with the speed of killing. Before the primal ment nerf you could really notice this with a few ments in party. Now, you'll need a few more people killing but can still see the effects pretty quickly with some offense..

Again Brad just let me know and I'll show you exactly what the problem is. It takes maybe 5-10 mins of Jihad killing to see the full effect.

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Post by art1 »

the problem in forged(DL):

one super party or 2 different party's hunting in forged controlling regen, once the regen gets killed, then respawn is slowed down(broken?). so basically after 15 min of both parties hunting the area and controlling the regen down to whenever a crit is spawned its hunted down and killed, after a while respawn time on crits are very slow. this might be same problem why bandits in DL respawn very slow, cause they take their sweet time to rot first then respawn. something must be done now since more and more primal people will be hunting down here in the near future, and fighting over 1 crit that spawns will be a big problem.
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Post by art1 »

as in i drop like 60-80 bodies to the ground, and only like 20-40 seem to respawn shortly after, then like 20-30, then like 5-15 at a time, and it kinda levels off at that.
same applies in forged. what should happen is every 2-3 minutes, the number of crits that are allocated in an area should all respawn and replinish the max number of crits tht an area can spawn. an example: if you allocated 50 crits in forged area to spawn, every 2-3 minutes, there should be 50 crits spawning again to replinish the losses. not more than 50, not less.

what happens is, after 50 crits are dead, 2-3 minutes later, 30 crits spawns. after those 30 crits are dead, 2-3 minutes later 20 crits spawn. again after 20 crits are killed, 2-3 minutes later, 10 crits are spawning in total in forged entire area. so people run out of crits to kill and keep going in circles trying to find a crit to kill.

these numbers are just used as an example from general hunting, and i didnt spend my time counting crit numbers. hope this helps.
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Post by Yeti »

i dunno if the new programming was added to aleria also, but hunting aleria about 10 minutes ago in the clicker/garg area - killing 1 npc ever 1-2 rounds - after 5 rounds through the area the number of npcs was reduced from 15ish per zoo when i first arrived, to 1 or less npcs per zoo.

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Post by Brad »

Some areas have fixed regen times, i'll have to tune places like aleria manually.

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Post by lalasushi »

forge was tested last night, a party of 5 people, 4 level 56, 1 level 55, were able to keep the regen in forge at around 3-5 crits alive at once. the regen is better but still doesnt replenish itself in any pheaseable way in order to account for even one real party let alone two.

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Post by Brad »

By the way, since this is a thread where I'm actually trying to focus in on fixing something, i'm deleting off topic comments that are detracting from the message flow.

Okay, on the regen issue. Remember that regen wont occur until corpses decay, so when you say your clearing something out in 5 rounds, are you saying after corpses decay, or a total of 5 rounds?

Also, areas are designed to be "sparse" if completely hunted out. The case of the forge is that its an exception area that we are trying to keep "brimming with crits", its why i asked the conversation to stay focused there.

I'll see if i can do something about corpse decay in areas like the forge, i havent visited that part of the problem

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Post by art1 »

Okay, on the regen issue. Remember that regen wont occur until corpses decay, so when you say your clearing something out in 5 rounds, are you saying after corpses decay, or a total of 5 rounds?
after corpse decay. what happens is we keep going in circles and circles trying to find a crit to kill and watch the corpse still decaying. this is perfectly fine if one party hunts there, but in drakkar many parties hunt in one area. so if one party of thief, healer, ment can keep regen down, 2 parties will devastate the area.

possible unasked solutions:

instaneous decay after they are killed (like spectres in km5 )
or
every 1 min you make all the crits in forged come back to life like it is when its not hunted at all by anyone, so the place is crawling with crits at all times and a party or 2 parties cant really beat regen down.
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