"Fixxing" unbroken things...

[Raiko]

Originally posted by Pax

Originally posted by Raiko


Pax:

The scenario data isn't scripted externally? I always assumed it was. If you guys use minimal scripts to drive the game, Brad might find it easier to recode some things to do that when he gets nameless to a better state.

Some parts of the scenario are scripted, some aren't (the older and "juicier" something is, the more likely it is hardcoded).

However, we are still limited by physical hardware and human resources. We don't have the physical hardware to support multiple test boxes to develop/debug on. This will come in time...

Ah, so it's more of a testing thing that you can't do. I see .

[Pax]

Originally posted by Raiko

Originally posted by Pax

Originally posted by Raiko


Pax:

The scenario data isn't scripted externally? I always assumed it was. If you guys use minimal scripts to drive the game, Brad might find it easier to recode some things to do that when he gets nameless to a better state.

Some parts of the scenario are scripted, some aren't (the older and "juicier" something is, the more likely it is hardcoded).

However, we are still limited by physical hardware and human resources. We don't have the physical hardware to support multiple test boxes to develop/debug on. This will come in time...

Ah, so it's more of a testing thing that you can't do. I see .

Just to clarify -- it is currently due to hardware (the lack thereof)/software (some process change) limitations. Once that is overcome, then we fall into qa resource constraints.

[Yeti]

yeah crush, you got whacked with all that, and still you didnt die...

the area is harder, oh shucks, you cant hunt ud5 no more while watching tv or reading a book...

this is an improvement the way i see it

-Yeti

[Crusher]

Originally posted by Yeti


yeah crush, you got whacked with all that, and still you didnt die...

the area is harder, oh shucks, you cant hunt ud5 no more while watching tv or reading a book...

this is an improvement the way i see it

-Yeti

Who said I didn't die? I had to get my DP numerous amounts of times. 2k E-lance didn't help much. Not to mention getting hit for 4k every 4 mins. Kinda takes the fun outa UD5.

[Yeti]

yep yep, UD is the only exception to the 'if you have the right gear, you are invincible' theory

personally, i stopped growing my barb because of the simple fact that while watchin 9 hours of tv per day, i could grow my barb 1 lvl per day in ud5, and only spend 9 hours playing computer and watching tv combined...

i think it SHOULD be a struggle to survive in ud, even for high lvled barbs in the top gear. this doesnt make it impossible for other classes to hunt the area, just means the other classes ought to watch where in the area they hunt. it is entirely possible to hunt the UD dungeon for HOURS and never see one ghast, not one.

-Yeti

[Yeti]

alrighty, since i stuck my neck out here, i figured i should go and make sure i wasnt wrong...

so, i went to UD5 in nork gear. wearing lg yeti, reggie, tarak robe, e/e iv helm, some other miscelanous junk, nothin special

<EDIT> forgot to mention i was swinging a grr hally instead of a +6, cuz the +6 was simply not cuttin it for damage output

i took 15 ihs with me

i spent about 15-20 minutes down there killin the northern zoo

made a grand total of 6.5m xp, 4m coin, and i got e-lanced a grand total of TWO times.

ghasts are just like all the other ud5 crits, they get in a certain mood, and go with it

generally blobs psi you and stun you, occasionally they will be AH happy, or EC happy, anyone that has hunted ud5 a while knows this

taking this into account, it is quite plausible that ghasts most often darkness/attack, but occasionally they will get a wild hair in their arse and e-lance the crap out of you

in that case, deal with em the same way you do with a ECing blob, just figure out which one it is and kack it, or move to a new area for a while and hope someone else will kill it, hehe

-Yeti

[lalasushi]

not all crits can survive a 2k elance, my capped ma can barely survive 1 alone, elance in its current incarnation in ud5 makes it impossible for non barbs to hunt near ghasts, simple as that, yes they can hunt there and risk ghast spawn in the random room, but hey, 2-3 use to spawn often in that room

[Yeti]

*shrug*

imho ud5 should be a party-only area

take a healer with you, and if you get blasted by a ghast, the healer can stun it and cc you, and then you can take it out. its not like ghasts have alot of hp...

also, in my 15-20 mins, i killed over a dozen ghasts before i was even e-lanced once... i think its a bit of an exaggeration to say that it is impossible to hunt near ghasts, it just makes it possible that you will die occasionally

-Yeti

[Crusher]

Originally posted by Yeti


also, in my 15-20 mins, i killed over a dozen ghasts before i was even e-lanced once... i think its a bit of an exaggeration to say that it is impossible to hunt near ghasts, it just makes it possible that you will die occasionally

-Yeti

Hunt there unzerked, in cob gear. E-lance can one shot you even with 2k hits. As I was getting Slantura's DP earlier, I grabbed his vani place and first thing to attack me was a 1.8k lance.

Just as you said, it's like an EC blob or disarm umber, but ghasts are common in most parts of UD5, leaving multiple targets. Ghasts are also resistant to physical damage more than the rest, not to mention their chance of PSI-mirror.

You mentioned the healer's joining and staying alive. The healer can't be alive if he is the first to die considering their low amount of hits and high chance of c-stun.

[freak]

Yeti you have just proven that armor means next to nothing, just more efficient, if you have 3500hps and vamp on hits and do massive damage like the barb.

Paladins max hps is 480+(lv-13)*22.
a lmaxed evel 50 paladin has 1294 hps. Everytime a ghast elances him he WILL die. While a barb going down there naked will be able to still do it.

I don't want to turn this into a class war so i'll stop there. But basically ud5 has pretty much always been a barb only place unless your in a good group or your near 50 anyway or willing to die 10-15 times every hour. Now it's basically barb only unless your willing to get one shotted everytime a ghast appears and decides to elance you.

EDIT: given the way drak is designed with barbs 50% hp bonus and vamp and the only class who can heal more than 1000hps with an ih using autobalm, making anywhere actually hard for a barb in cob makes it impossible for other classes.

Freak

[Yeti]

so why go unzerked crush? as freak said, ud5 has been basically a barb only zone since it first came out, unless you had a good group. a good group can still hunt in ud5, they may die a couple times, but big deal. just kill the ghasts first, its really not that hard...

and yeah, armor only makes the UD dungeons more convenient for barbs. but this is not a new revelation, my barb does most of the game naked, hehe. has for a long time

it makes the areas actually a wee little tiny bit challenging, and makes it somewhat possible that there is a small chance that i will die, adds a little fun into it.

also, i have said for well over a year now, the gear barbs were given to "fix" the poor broken class <eg sas fur and gk2 hally and those special handy robes> was well WELL beyond what the barbs needed. barb were lacking 1 thing, #arg. but, since they squeaked real loud, they got lots and lots of oil, which overcompensated for the barbs sucktedness. if you look back over the forum archives you will see like 4-5 seperate threads where me/elessar/hoss<watcher> are arguing about it <G>

heres my own personal favorite <G>

http://kingdomofdrakkar.com/newforums/v ... php?t=1567

<edit>
im dusting off my cob gear right now and gonna head down and try to find a ghast to e-lance me a dozen times or so, see if he can oneshot me unzerked :D

<edit number 2>
alrighty, in the time it took me to find ghasts and stand around and try to get them to e-lance me, and manage to get e-lanced 3 times, for 1792, 1803, 1936 damage, i died once to a blobs EC, once to a blob charming me, once to a rada with guants whacking the crap out of me, and once to a combo of mummies/umber disarm. and i died 0 times to the 3 e-lances...

hehe, just died another time to shred/e-spear combo after i posted this when i was OMW to grab my hally...

-Yeti

[funns]

well crusher if ya wanna know where my last post went, i blame my eyes and i was laying down on my bed hehe, i went to hit edit, and accidentaly hit delete instead lol

[Roland]

My thought is that the Elance should be increased, so it CAN 1shot the barbs. But...put an item in Cob that all classes in CoB can wear, except the barb class, that gives Elance protection so the ghasts are just a minor nuance to the other classes, since the other UD stuff can kill the other classes. UD-5 gives big rewards, and is about the best area in Cob to grow quickly, so all classes should be given that benefit. Not make it easier, just put barbs in UD-5 on level ground with everyone else. Something some people call ..BALANCE !

PS: If a person is playing a crit in a topend area , and stacking commands and watching TV , just passively watching the game, would seem to be a question of balance.

[Crusher]

Should it be an act of ignorance that kills someone? Yes. It shouldn't be--no matter what you do or wear, you will die to a ghast in one shot.

[Yeti]

lets see, a major pooled MA wont <yes i know its impractical to keep majorpooled hps all the time, but that does fall under "no matter what"

an evil fighter with sufficient koss-mace pooled hps wont <yeah, i know, its a stretch but still>

any class with dion pooled hps wont get oneshotted...

a lv 50 pally or MA holding a egg shield wouldnt get oneshotted...

and, as with most other things, the best way to NOT DIE, is to NOT GET HIT

let someone else be the bait, and bring things to you, or just advance before you. if you are going N in a n/s hall, and have cleared the area S of you, and are partied with a barb, stay 1 hex below the barb while you are getting new crits, that way each add will target the barb rather than you, and then, if it is a crit such as a ghast that you are worried about whipping your arse, kill it first.... seriously, a little bit of strategy makes ud5 easily huntable. now, a pally or MA is not going to be able to charge into ud5 heart and expect to live... but that is not anything new, they never have been able to really

arguing with you reminds me of arguing with hoss crusher...
"Me: i can solo in ud5
hoss: if i drag 50 crits on you, will you die?
me: yes
hoss: then you cant solo there!

its like saying that a lv 13 crit cant do well in n6 because ocasionally a big healer will come and stun/ec them to death, or if they disintegrated all the walls and drag the whole level onto themselves, they would die

god forbid you actually have to use a bit of strategy to hunt in cob, sheesh
-Yeti

[Acaciam]

A level 50 pally or MA won't get one-shotted but a level 50 pally or MA won't be in ud5 because they can't get exp there.

My MA has 1300 something hp with egg shield and if I get lanced its hopeless, granted it doesn't happen every round, when it does happen i'm dead.

Don't talk about majorpool here because anyone who actually has majorpool knows that as soon as you step into ud5 something is going to take away your pooled hits. Whether or not it be a Blob's ec, a lance shot, a % attack, or a big melee hit, they are gone immediately and you are sucking down the IHes.

I know its being worked on and I know some think it unfair, but we were warned about it and knew it was coming. I have no problem with it, but I do think that if all other classes are being 1-shotted by it, then barbs should be also. So make it hit for 5k and it kill everything or make it hit for 1k where others can live through a lance shot.

[Yeti]

hehe, im all for increasing the damage to make it fair, make the lance hit for 15k to be sure everyone will die to it <WEG>

-Yeti

[Roland]

The point I was trying to make was that if you are in a party without a barbie to bait the ghasts, the party won't do too well, sure you can use strategy and take out the ghasts first, but still, when they first regen and decide to use elance, someone WILL die. Just balance out the area. The elance thing is a step in the right direction, just needs the damage upped so it 'can' 1 shot barbs too, so they can be the danger for the barbs, and give the other classes something they can use to protect against the elance. Sure sounds unfair if you are a barb, but as things are now in Cob, probably about the only way to balance things out a bit with barbs being SOOOO strong in Cob, without nerfing the entire class everywhere in Cob. Heck, even some of the other things in UD-5 could have their damage minorly increased so they pose more of a threat to the other classes, since the others won't be bothered by the elance. Just a balance, to make it fair and challenging, so with crits the proper size, and using some strategy, they have a shot at succeeding there. No matter how good, or how big a healer is , they will die. A party with a thiefy, ment, healer, pally, and MA after a few hours play would more than likely get disgusted with all the nonsense deaths due to the elance (deaths that they really can't do anything about regardless of how they gear or how good of player they are). If you have an area where a more than full party of crits with everything except barbs, can't do too well, but you can have a solo barb do EXTREMELY well, imho, shows a vast inbalance of an area.

[Crusher]

Why not make the game where you can't get experience without 3 people partying. If there is a step in the right direction, it would be having the ghast/umber's lance do 1.25k-1.5k to a 1 person party, 750-1k to a 2 person party, and 250-500 in a 3+ party.

I know MA's and Pallies could solo in UD5 with only the 3 eastern most north rooms. They still can, but there is no use for a psi-crush ammy or an agil ammy if you are going to die every 5-10 mins. Almost all would rather wear a steve ammy for the "balancing" e-lance.

[Northview]

Originally posted by Crusher


Why not make the game where you can't get experience without 3 people partying. If there is a step in the right direction, it would be having the ghast/umber's lance do 1.25k-1.5k to a 1 person party, 750-1k to a 2 person party, and 250-500 in a 3+ party.

I know MA's and Pallies could solo in UD5 with only the 3 eastern most north rooms. They still can, but there is no use for a psi-crush ammy or an agil ammy if you are going to die every 5-10 mins. Almost all would rather wear a steve ammy for the "balancing" e-lance.

ya, i think i might have to agree with crusher on this, have it to where the ghasts cast elance but dont form at a target, make it hit everything red to him(which would be us)

it would have the same effect as if an elance ment were to form elance but not chose a target, it would split the damage up between all the red critters he saw.

the only down side to this is...exp gets cut after you have so many people in party..but you wouldnt be getting 1 shot left and right...so i guess its just a matter of choice.

[Crusher]

I think there is a ment disc that is split-lance or something.

[Rosey]

If your target goes offscreen when you are lancing you get this somewhat weaker version of lance that hits everything that is red.

Rosey__RIP

[Hulk]

area enmiss?

[finalwarrior]

This reply is for Roland. I know you are all for nerfing barbs. I have read other posts from you regarding this issue. Your Pally will never be a barb. Nor will your thief. Each class has its advantages and disadvanteges as you know. Maybe you should make a barb. I do get bored with my barb. Not because he is not being challenged enough, but because I get tired of zerking up and hitting my #arg macro button. This is my barbs only abiliy. And it gets really boring. I would love for my barb to use max strike or maybe just cast a fireball and I also wish he had just 150 eps, but then he wouldn't be a barb anymore. So, when I want to cast a couple fireballs I go to my 2nd character, a ment. I sugest you do the same and make a barb. On another hand, I think complaints like this are an insult to the people who try there best to balance the game. You should try taking my barb to NL sometime. Pallys kill much faster there. There are areas in drakkar that barbs are better, and areas that pallys are better. We as the players have to use this to our advantage aginst the Evil do'ers. Sorry for putting this in the wrong spot in forum but I could not let someone bang on my crit like that without me saying something. We get banged on enough.

P.S. My barbs lv.38 and I no longer hunt alone in UD5 I get rocked there!

~Taloon

[Joesy001]

here here, alot of people need to get over that every class vs the Barbs, i know this doesnt apply to everyone, but there is a few out there.


3 words for ya's


GET OVER IT :D