Unused class ideas

[Acaciam]

I hear that merchants will be a playable class from the dev chat with Brad, so I'm expecting that they will get some trade skills to make rolling and building a merchant a worthwhile thing to do. But as far as fighters, no one plays a fighter and everyone wants to dual weild weapons so how about fighters (non-pally) being able to dual weild when they get bigger, would be a cool way for people to play just a regular old fighter.

[Drdrunk]

dual wield koss maces, woohoo

[GhostGuest]

But as far as fighters, no one plays a fighter
I have to dissagree with this statement.. since my main crit, Woodenkarl, IS a strait fighter. But i do agree with your idea about giving a pure fighter dual weild skill ( yes, i say SKILL). Point in fact i have even posted so before, though i believe it was on the news server. And i have to admit i get a bit irratated by Barbs who complain of their class being "nerfed", they arnt neeer as nerfed as my pure fighter is!!! Well at least, thats just me opinions any way, and yes.. i do have a small baby barb so i do know a small bit about them. Now back to dual weild, i would liet sortake to see it skill level based. Have it start kicking in at about the same time as Pallys start getting their foci's, just so they either dont get their feelings hurt( if it started earlier than their foci's), or so they dont get too big a head( if it starts after they get their foci's) ( and Danged if they dont get sorta big headed any way). Well these just me rambling thoughts, and hope i aint offened any 'o ya. GL&HH to ya All.

[Emily]

When it comes to fighters, there is no real benefit...

Think of it this way, you have a choice...

1. Make a fighter who gains special abilities (Paladin with foci)

...or...

2. Make a fighter who never gets anything along the lines of abilities (Fighter class)

Dual weild sounds fair, so would adding some other abilities. Maybe allow bow specialization and add some nice bows to the game, restricted to fighters, add two-handed attacks/dual weilding, maybe add some offensive level bonusses, like a natural +1/0 every 5 levels for being a hardnosed fighter, and maybe something similar to AD&D where fighters advanced levels with a few less XP than other classes, easily addapted to Drak by awarding a small percentage more XP for each kill to fighter class (even if only 1-5% more xp for each kill)


I'd also like to see something added to the game like a Ranger class, with ideas like +1 to movement (running skill) after a certain level, maybe a tracking ability, where you enter something like "#track roc" and they get a general description of which direction the nearest roc is in, "north", "west", "southwest", etc.. Allow them natural bonusses for weapons like spear, bow, etc... Maybe give some hiding ability, some resistance to element and water damage and at some level, perhaps even a few disciplines like find friendly (summoning), detox and mend limited to use on same hex, and at high enough skill, maybe even reveal. Also due to ranger's attention to detail (like when tracking something), maybe also give them detect at some point. They could also make use of special traps (like hunter's traps) that would only hold a creature on 1 spot for a certain number of rounds.

A Ranger could also be worked in as something like a multiclass, similar to mixxing fighter and thief.

[Hotice]

Ranger could also have better range of vision while in places like a forest or jungle... would seem fair..

it does help when trying to find dion in jungle <G>

[Dragonslayer]

the only ädvantage"of fighter, is being able to wield neatral and evil alinged weapons, i do think they should get more, or maybe even make a "dark guard"class, as being the oposite, evil counterpart of a paladin.

[Mihey]

Hmm an opposite of a paladin would be a villain, e/e aligned.

Well, I hoped fighter class would evolve into several sub-classes, depending on specialization and such; like archer, who would specialize in bow and gain special attacks with it (i.e. rapid or multiple shots, fire arrows etc.), skirmisher with great speed, light weapon proficiencies (however it spells), limited to light armor, uncanny dodging abilities (as they have lighter armor, they have to evade attacks), blademaster, a sword specialist showing finesse with bladed weapons, limited to medium armor though (hard to juggle with swords in heavy plate such as full plate!) etc.

In general, each "general" class should open ways to several "specialized" sub-classes, which are enabled after a certain requirement is met (skill, experience, aligment, stats...)

Or one can choose to continue growing a pure fighter, pure mentalist, pure barb etc. instead of an archer, a conjurer or highlander :p

Plenty possibilities, this would require a lot efforts to code in, if not replace the current system... But should be easy to code simple sub-classes... paladin is a sub-class of a fighter that is enabled at exp level 8, right? then there is fighter/mentalist etc.

The main problem would be how to balance classes, as they may throw game off balance...

[Acaciam]

My point was that there was no real advantage to being a fighter, like Emily said. Why in the heck would you not be a pally and get all the great foci's? Since people would like to dual weild weapons, make the pure fighter be able to. If a pally could dual weild, they would get too powerful, focus parry with two sabres? Make fighters able to put a weapon in left hand also with a penalty to the damage both weapons do, but as they advance in level (just so they can dual weild weapons that aren't the same, like a mace and a LS) they become more coordinated with using their left hand, ambidextrious. Another level based class would be cool anyway, so a level 25 fighter could hold two weapons and not get a damage penalty.

A ranger class would be totally cool, improved vision and speed, able to spec in bow/throwing, and maybe give him a little healing skill, because after all, he is a ranger. Super cool ideas.

Pallys can always go between fighters and paladins, but I dont think a pally should be able to kill a non-hostile and become one of the new fighters when they wanna dual weild every now and then, if this new fighter class takes affect, make it to where it is a class by itself so when a pally drops his pallyhood, he got nuttin. Its not pally-hate, but pallys got some cool things, they just can't get everything.

[Acaciam]

Oh, and as far as your woodenkarl.. You have no reason not to become a pally, maybe you were one at some point and lost pallyhood and could never get betty, or you are just want to take the bumpy road and play a plain fighter. whichever reason you have, you got no reason to whine about being a fighter when you could just atone up and be a pally.

[GhostGuest]

Ummmm.. just to set the record striaght.... I'm not trying to "whine" aout being a pure fighter, but just state the facts.... that a pure fighter is much more nerfed than a barb. Now as to why im a pure fighter, it's simply cause i wanna be. I wanted to see how far i can take one. I just wanted to be different. And finaly..... why not?? Again, i dont want to sound like I'm complaining, because i do realize it is my own choice. And point in fact, i kinda enjoy the challenge. Even so, i do whish the class had some of the suggested changes.
Now, some one corect me if im wrong, but i do beleive that Pallys that have lost their Pallyhood can wield the n/n and e/e weapons if they meet the required alignments. I know that when i'm not g/g, i cant use Griffys or other silver longswords( all of which are g/g as far as i know).

[Ravaillac]

I agree with GhostGuest that supporting the Fighter class as a stand-alone would probably be good for drakkar in that it would increase diversity in both play and roleplay possibility.

As it stands now, Fighters fight at 1 skill level below paladins, have 1 fewer attack per round, and have 2 fewer willpower.

It would be nice if they had their own abilities or if they shared abilities with paladins but had a broader selection of weapons/armors.

-Ravaillac

[Crusher]

We'll the fighter class was never really popular and the Paladin was a bonus along with it... There could be changes to the fighter and make it a bit stronger, fighter is like the middle of a barb and Pally, Pally being highly defensive and Barb being Offensive... SO maby make a fighter have its own little commands that add to the Paladin's Foci? or just a seperate "power"? The Merchant needs something to it, It would be fun to see people playing as merchants and going on hunts "if a blacksmith" repairing weapons and armor as they attack so they do max damage? or use a hammer and whack at the things?

[Acaciam]

Originally posted by Ravaillac


I agree with GhostGuest that supporting the Fighter class as a stand-alone would probably be good for drakkar ...

-Ravaillac

um...

[Ravaillac]

My sentence didnt end there.

READING IS FUNDAMENTAL!

[Roland]

Ravaillac, " I agree with GhostGuest that ... the Fighter...would...own..paladins."

I don't agree with you there Ravaillac ! <EG>



Roland,
"Follower of The Old Code"

[Watcher]

Originally posted by GhostGuest


Ummmm.. just to set the record striaght.... I'm not trying to "whine" aout being a pure fighter, but just state the facts.... that a pure fighter is much more nerfed than a barb. Now as to why im a pure fighter, it's simply cause i wanna be. I wanted to see how far i can take one. I just wanted to be different. And finaly..... why not?? Again, i dont want to sound like I'm complaining, because i do realize it is my own choice. And point in fact, i kinda enjoy the challenge. Even so, i do whish the class had some of the suggested changes.
Now, some one corect me if im wrong, but i do beleive that Pallys that have lost their Pallyhood can wield the n/n and e/e weapons if they meet the required alignments. I know that when i'm not g/g, i cant use Griffys or other silver longswords( all of which are g/g as far as i know).

Maybe your definition of "nerfed" is different from mine, I'm sure the Fighter Class has never had anything taken away from them that I'm aware. The Fighter Class also has greater versatility of becoming more than it is. It can go from Fighter to Paladin or Fighter to Fighter/Mentalist.

Paladins when they lose their alignments become fighters. This is unique in Drakkar, no other class can revert to another class and back again anytime they wish.

There was a thought at one time to make a class called the Warrior Class, however, the distinction between Barbarians and pure Fighters became very fuzzy. Most thought it would become a Ranger-like class which would make it different.

If the fighter class becomes a separate improved class, then they should remove the ability for Paladins to become pure Fighter/Warriors just as Fighter/Mentalists can no longer become Fighters.

Perhaps a distinction is a totally new and separate class where one dedicates from Fighter to a Warrior Class.

I don't see it in the current role of Drakkar though and it would probably dilute the distinctions of the classes as they are now. Possibilites yes; implementation - a heck of a lot of work for the overworked Brad.

[Ravaillac]

Hoss, it would be enough of a start to add weapons, armor, and possibly other gear that has non-good alignment, and to allow fighters the use of abilities similar to those used by paladins.

The question really is do we want to make Fighter a fully supported class, or do we want to make being a fighter just a PUNISHMENT for paladins who lose their alignment?

I think for roleplaying purposes alone it would be nice to have a choice of warrior, but I wouldnt want this to come at the EXPENSE of paladins.

[Watcher]

Originally posted by Ravaillac


Hoss, it would be enough of a start to add weapons, armor, and possibly other gear that has non-good alignment, and to allow fighters the use of abilities similar to those used by paladins.

The question really is do we want to make Fighter a fully supported class, or do we want to make being a fighter just a PUNISHMENT for paladins who lose their alignment?

I think for roleplaying purposes alone it would be nice to have a choice of warrior, but I wouldnt want this to come at the EXPENSE of paladins.

I never thought of losing alignment as a punishment <g>. It's annoying as heck, multistriking in Cobrahn Desert and have a townie leap out onto your hex or some other quirk of the game.

The fighter is pretty versatile now. It can use all weapons unless it's class designated and can go on two separate paths, Paladin or Fighter/Mentalists. Of course, it can remain a fighter as well.

Haven't thought about the Warrior class in quite awhile, maybe Brad had some ideas back in the caverns of his brain <g>.

It would be interesting to see alignment dedicated armor. An evil fullplate or perhaps a e/e helm of some kind. Perhaps a neutral set of Fighter Gauntlets, dunno which direction one would want to go on alignment. Would have to be n/n or e/e to be different than the Paladin.

[GhostGuest]

Watcher: "The fighter is pretty versatile now. It can use all weapons unless it's class designated and can go on two separate paths, Paladin or Fighter/Mentalists. Of course, it can remain a fighter as well."

A Fighter that becomes a Paladin or a FM is not a Fighter any more. If he "remain(s) a fighter as well", then he is just that, and only that, a Fighter. And one with no special abilities,.... and That is the point of the original post.

Also, I would have to dissagree with those who keep saying that the fighter is the only one that can use all weapons. Any class can use any weapon. And any class can use any alignment of weapon, if they meet the alignment requirements. Granted, Pallys do lose their special skills when they lose GG alignment. But, they can get them back by attoning.

Watcher, I do like your sugestion of special gear for a Fighter. But the alignment doesnt have to be something other than GG. All it needs to be is class specific.

[Acaciam]

Originally posted by Acaciam

Originally posted by Ravaillac


I agree with GhostGuest that supporting the Fighter class as a stand-alone would probably be good for drakkar ...

-Ravaillac

um...

point was.. my idea :/

[matts the man]

that is stupid. the reason merchants suck is because you arent supposet to stay a merchant always! Thats what classes are for! Whats a merchant gonna do? Throw rocks??I think merchants should stay the same!!

[Acaciam]

no... from what I have read, they want to make merchant a class... ie.. able to learn skills like repair gear, forge weapons, barter, etc.. It would probably be a good way to make money. right now, a merchant is just someone who is undedicated. stupid you say? thats how i feel about a fighter who isn't a pally, thats like buying a car with no motor. you put a motor in it and it does cool things like ... moves. put a little pally into a fighter and it does stuff like.. disarm, maxstrike, parry, etc.. take the pally out and it does.. nuttin.

the way i would like to see it is this:
fighter becomes a stand alone class, at level 8 you have the option of staying a fighter, or become a paladin. if you choose paladin, you become a regular old paladin like the ones are now EXCEPT that if you lose alignment you dont become a fighter, you become like a naughty boy or something.. and have to do a quest to atone to pallyhood again.. like betty. only thing that would change is not going back to fighter, then the class would be too fun to be 2 classes, my ma would have to be able to go evil and become a healer sometimes to make things fair..

the fighter class on the other hand will be sorta like a pally, just not all goody goody and get some new and different, perhaps even some usefull, skills to play with. like dual weild, or whatever. could even be called warrior and at level 8 the fighter can either be pally or warrior and nothing would change with pallys, just warrior would be a new class. Maybe even put the minimum at level 10 for warriors just so you have to be extra tough and stick it out a little longer. maybe instead of 2 will points, warriors can get 2 str points.

[Emily]

Originally posted by matts the man


that is stupid. the reason merchants suck is because you arent supposet to stay a merchant always! Thats what classes are for! Whats a merchant gonna do? Throw rocks??I think merchants should stay the same!!

In the past, several people have played merchants for the shear challenge... Never any special attacks, no added attacks per round or class training. It was one of the most difficult challenges in the game, to play a merchant and find some success. Yet, people did, even I did up until about level 11 or 12. Some played merchants just to have fewer competitors on the old scoreboards.

[Roland]

a Merchant class in a way would make for a fun secondary crit.
as it is now, alot of people make ments to enchant and do things for earning some coin.
Why not have a class designed specifically for that, granted, this class isn't gonna be the best in the dungeons, but the skills have to be earned somehow <g>
And once you get the merchant up to lvl's where he can forge weapons, enchant? weapons, or provide other benefits for other classes in the game, he'll be fun.
Just a matter of getting him to the point of where he is useful. Also, keep in mind, this is a merchant class, designer to provide a service in exchange for gold, that's what merchants do ! And DO NOT expect them to be that good of a killer, that isn't their role.
Seems like this class will provide a nice challenge for the seasoned Drak players, and as they get bigger in size, the whole Drak Community will benefit, and that merchant's banker and other crits will be very happy in return

[felixice]

ive been reading and about 60% of the time i read something about lair crits wich gies me and idea there being crits that must stay in a dungen and they finde there gear there and stuff like thay can be a yeti on yeti island or somthing or they cold be dragon and they have to keep training in a SECRET ERREA and get there armor in secret erreas then if there killed and tanned they can use onther of they same class dont matter if there tanned or not they choose wather there good or evil if they kill crits or help crits but THEY CAN NEVER TELL THE SECRET ERREA OR GIVE HINTS ON THE SCRET ERREA I think that will be cool